we are messing around with BIM at our firm ... one of the other teams is doing a pilot project ... we are a MicroStation shop ... we are testing Bentley Architecture, which is the MicroStation BIM product ... the jury's still out on this, but it does seem to have some interesting possiblilities ... our guys seem to think this has some real potential as a design tool.
Learning Digital Project (CATIA) - slow, but we're getting there. Great surface modeller, parametric stuff, with BIM capabilities, finite analysis, and more goodies I haven't disovered yet. Its fun, but really time-consuming, which puts it squarely in the design-development category. Not so good for quick sketches - Rhino is still the best for that. However, once a model's relationships are set, you can produce an unlimited number of versions in a very short amount of time.
I'm curious to the possibilities of solidworks being used in smaller projects such as light commercial/Residential applications in the same fashion as Digital project. As I understand it, digital project is an optimized version for architecture. It seems that the most recent versions of solidworks has moved beyond it's limitations of assembly sizes. I saw a demonstration of the 2006 version and was impressed on the size of assemblies it can handle. Digital project seems to be well suited for larger projects but for single family projects it seems like it would be over kill.
Hey, I appreciate the responses -- (by the way, JohnProlly, that is my preferred method) --
Out here in the sticks I've spent the last few years in firms where they practically demanded that everything was in single lines on layers with really arcane names -- no objects, no actual 3D anything... unfortunately it's left me a bit behind the curve, and so this parametric BIM thing is really foreign to me. It sounds like a couple of you are doing what I'm doing -- a test project using BIM within the mainstream of the office I work for. It's a slow start... on a small project, we've used the BIM for plans, building sections, and elevations, and are 2D-ing the details. It's a structure with a lot of curves, and I'll say this, it is very, very cool to hit a couple commands and have perfect elevations pop up. However, for the most part --I'm still lost in BIM-country.
We have a copy of Revit in my office but for whatever reason, haven't started toying with it yet. OK, I think I know the reasons and I think it has to do with our computer guy's insecurity issues, but I digress....
I was thinking I would just install it on my own and start learning it. From what I gather, it is still a long way from file size efficiency, like it has to be a very small project for the file to be manageable, but it is still a fantastic tool.
I would fall over dead if my bosses purchased CATIA.
We've been using Revit for over 2 years and project size is not an issue. It's a perfectly useable tool for design and production, but until consultants get on board BIM won't live up to it's potential, regardless of what platform you use.
Frit ... if you are the architect and you want to use BIM on your projects, what are the consultants saying about their reasons for not getting on board ... don't they work for you ?
I guess if we were an SOM or HOK size company, we might pull that kind of weight with consultants. As it stands, they would simply stop working with us if we made that kind of demand. Which would be fine if there was someone to fill that void who was any different, but in Atlanta at least we can't find any structural or MEP consultants using BIM packages yet.
Frit: i take your point. however, if you believe in the future of bim, then maybe you ought to seek out one (or more) small engineering firms in each discipline and discuss a strategic alliance with those firms. persuade them to acquire a bim license (or, you could buy it for them) and start working together to fully explore the full potential of this new technology.
the main reason architects have lost influence in the design and construction process is because we've failed to lead. if we sit back and let our consultants (of all people) dictate how we do our work, it's only going to get worse. figure out what you need and then make it happen
Well this brings up another question I have, then, in reference to consultants and BIM. In my experience, it really hasn't mattered much what we send to them as far as CAD goes. While I realize that, say, a BIM-savvy MEP guy could make great use of the 3D capabilities of BIM software, I can hardly envision them attempting it... I think all our MEP consultants do is take our drawings, change them to a half-tone block, and draw over them. Will BIM really make any difference for them?
Again, I practice out in the sticks, so maybe some of your consultants are more forward looking. (Hell, I sometimes have to stall on projects during duck season, etc., because many of our consultants are avid hunters...)
I think its sad that so few consulting firms use BIMs. I walked into a garage the other day, to have work done on my car, and the mechanics are using BIMs to repair cars now. They just pull up the make and model of the car, it pops up on their flat screen, and they can pick any part of the car, and the model will show them exactly how it goes together. Now, if the structural, landscape and MEP guys we're working with would learn how to use Revit, we could really do the same thing for builders, but instead we just end up wasting a lot of time exporting to AutoCAD files.
Quizzical: That's actually the path were going down right now, trying to identify some firms that are open-minded enough to listen to us.
Rim Joist: The nice part of an MEP guy using BIM is that I can reference his model in mine for error and interference checking. We actually do this now ourselves by creating relevent portions of the MEP and Strucural designs in seperate models and linking them in. It happens too late in the process to have the most impact and it's extra work we don't really have time for, but it's better than nothing.
And to be fair, the consultant BIM platforms are only just starting to enter the market in a useable form, at least as far as Revit is concerned. Structure has been available for less than a year and MEP is still in beta.
I've heard that . . . was it Norway? Denmark? . . . one of the nordic countries, is making incredible use of the BIM concept, from schematic design to specs and permiting.
BIM?
This topic has surely been addressed already...
However, I have a question for anyone currently practicing: What software are you using, and what is the consensus on BIM?
My phone has a SIM, thank you.
we are messing around with BIM at our firm ... one of the other teams is doing a pilot project ... we are a MicroStation shop ... we are testing Bentley Architecture, which is the MicroStation BIM product ... the jury's still out on this, but it does seem to have some interesting possiblilities ... our guys seem to think this has some real potential as a design tool.
Revit by AutoDesk
Learning Digital Project (CATIA) - slow, but we're getting there. Great surface modeller, parametric stuff, with BIM capabilities, finite analysis, and more goodies I haven't disovered yet. Its fun, but really time-consuming, which puts it squarely in the design-development category. Not so good for quick sketches - Rhino is still the best for that. However, once a model's relationships are set, you can produce an unlimited number of versions in a very short amount of time.
I'm curious to the possibilities of solidworks being used in smaller projects such as light commercial/Residential applications in the same fashion as Digital project. As I understand it, digital project is an optimized version for architecture. It seems that the most recent versions of solidworks has moved beyond it's limitations of assembly sizes. I saw a demonstration of the 2006 version and was impressed on the size of assemblies it can handle. Digital project seems to be well suited for larger projects but for single family projects it seems like it would be over kill.
Chip Board, tacky glue and a glue syringe.
Hey, I appreciate the responses -- (by the way, JohnProlly, that is my preferred method) --
Out here in the sticks I've spent the last few years in firms where they practically demanded that everything was in single lines on layers with really arcane names -- no objects, no actual 3D anything... unfortunately it's left me a bit behind the curve, and so this parametric BIM thing is really foreign to me. It sounds like a couple of you are doing what I'm doing -- a test project using BIM within the mainstream of the office I work for. It's a slow start... on a small project, we've used the BIM for plans, building sections, and elevations, and are 2D-ing the details. It's a structure with a lot of curves, and I'll say this, it is very, very cool to hit a couple commands and have perfect elevations pop up. However, for the most part --I'm still lost in BIM-country.
We have a copy of Revit in my office but for whatever reason, haven't started toying with it yet. OK, I think I know the reasons and I think it has to do with our computer guy's insecurity issues, but I digress....
I was thinking I would just install it on my own and start learning it. From what I gather, it is still a long way from file size efficiency, like it has to be a very small project for the file to be manageable, but it is still a fantastic tool.
I would fall over dead if my bosses purchased CATIA.
We've been using Revit for over 2 years and project size is not an issue. It's a perfectly useable tool for design and production, but until consultants get on board BIM won't live up to it's potential, regardless of what platform you use.
Frit ... if you are the architect and you want to use BIM on your projects, what are the consultants saying about their reasons for not getting on board ... don't they work for you ?
quizzical,
I guess if we were an SOM or HOK size company, we might pull that kind of weight with consultants. As it stands, they would simply stop working with us if we made that kind of demand. Which would be fine if there was someone to fill that void who was any different, but in Atlanta at least we can't find any structural or MEP consultants using BIM packages yet.
Frit: i take your point. however, if you believe in the future of bim, then maybe you ought to seek out one (or more) small engineering firms in each discipline and discuss a strategic alliance with those firms. persuade them to acquire a bim license (or, you could buy it for them) and start working together to fully explore the full potential of this new technology.
the main reason architects have lost influence in the design and construction process is because we've failed to lead. if we sit back and let our consultants (of all people) dictate how we do our work, it's only going to get worse. figure out what you need and then make it happen
Well this brings up another question I have, then, in reference to consultants and BIM. In my experience, it really hasn't mattered much what we send to them as far as CAD goes. While I realize that, say, a BIM-savvy MEP guy could make great use of the 3D capabilities of BIM software, I can hardly envision them attempting it... I think all our MEP consultants do is take our drawings, change them to a half-tone block, and draw over them. Will BIM really make any difference for them?
Again, I practice out in the sticks, so maybe some of your consultants are more forward looking. (Hell, I sometimes have to stall on projects during duck season, etc., because many of our consultants are avid hunters...)
I think its sad that so few consulting firms use BIMs. I walked into a garage the other day, to have work done on my car, and the mechanics are using BIMs to repair cars now. They just pull up the make and model of the car, it pops up on their flat screen, and they can pick any part of the car, and the model will show them exactly how it goes together. Now, if the structural, landscape and MEP guys we're working with would learn how to use Revit, we could really do the same thing for builders, but instead we just end up wasting a lot of time exporting to AutoCAD files.
Quizzical: That's actually the path were going down right now, trying to identify some firms that are open-minded enough to listen to us.
Rim Joist: The nice part of an MEP guy using BIM is that I can reference his model in mine for error and interference checking. We actually do this now ourselves by creating relevent portions of the MEP and Strucural designs in seperate models and linking them in. It happens too late in the process to have the most impact and it's extra work we don't really have time for, but it's better than nothing.
And to be fair, the consultant BIM platforms are only just starting to enter the market in a useable form, at least as far as Revit is concerned. Structure has been available for less than a year and MEP is still in beta.
I've heard that . . . was it Norway? Denmark? . . . one of the nordic countries, is making incredible use of the BIM concept, from schematic design to specs and permiting.
BIM Case Study #2
These gives a little insight into some of the more complex application benefits of BIM
Interesting, babs...
Has anyone had any experience with getting accurate material take-offs from BIM?
what about archicad? They've been doing BIM for a while and also have an optional organic 3d modelling plugin by maxon, so you can be more creative.
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