How mature of you, SMIB. You just confirmed all of my suspicions about you. And that's not flattery, though I know you're trying your hardest to be a troll and stir up shit just for the sake of being a dick.

Well done. I guess. Whatever.

Ive been quiet too long. I love hand drawing. Love render sketches. However hand drawing actualy in my opinion can be more misleading about the final product. Look at those rudolph sketches and other modernist sketches and renderings - now go visit some of those buildings and tell me they dont suck.

Well, that would be a personal judgement not necessarily connected to the quality of some original office renderings, wouldn't it ? But you raise the question of whether hand drawings might be even less likely to convey the reality of a building design than would a computer rendering -- as I take it. If so, why ? I'd accept that the the perspective would be dimensionally and opticallly accurate, and the shadows (if present) would be correct (given the choices made by the delineator) in the CAD drawing.

Recent work by Ms Hadid is persuasively presented in office (?) renderings published in a recent GA Document. . . Quite impressive and tasty drawings.

As THE solution to this argument, listen up, chumps...
Not to foster any more feelings of inadequacy or anything (which by the way reminds me of my last physical in that cold, cold exam room) but this debate was all already solved about 8 years ago in an office I worked in...an aging partner unwittingly bridged the gap between the drawing camp and the computer camp -- by sketching with a sharpie pen directly on my computer monitor...! I turned in awe toward the old magnificent bastard with only one word: BRILLIANT!!!

And we're done! Thanks, ZipGUN, for finally wrapping all that up, good times.

Okay, next topic - AutoCAD's new menu layout: threat to civilization, or menace to society? I mean seriously, what's up with that?

yes, it is a menace to society and a threat to civilized existence as we know it.

Use "AutoCAD Classic" and RMB next to the big A (but not on the big A) and select "show menu" something or other to get all the menu pulldowns back…

Gotta love that big 'A', right? I mean, is this a Vista thing, or what? Are we witnessing the end of the old 'File, Edit, ...' menu structure?

ZipGUN -- Love it. Leave it to those old bastards to cut to the chase. Reminds me of sophomore studio, one evening; I had something Baroque playing on a portable turntable-in-a-box, and Professor So-and-so marched over from the next cubicle where he was giving a private crit and pulled the plug. Served me right, I suppose. . .