Come on, admit it, we all want to know. It's all anyone talks about. So who's canned 5, 10, 20, 30 people today? What happened, how many, how'd they do it? If your firm has, log it here with a quick entry for posterity.

announcements of it only

what? another depressing thread about architects getting fired? can we keep the pessimism to a minimum?

No, B3, this is not some morbid fascination with the day's latest depressing fired-architect news. Rather, the idea is that this might actually be useful and informative - particularly the many, many, many out there looking for work. At least if you know who's just laid off 12 people, you won't bother wasting time and postage sending them a resume, that's all. You'll also know what kind of firms are doing better, and which are doing worse.

Antisthenes, exactly. Brief. Firm size, number of people. Main market sector. Done.

And if you haven't figured out what's going on yet and just how horrendous it is (and stunningly, I've run into more than a few) perhaps this thread might be a much-needed wake-up call.

Finally, in three or four years time, should anyone search keyword "recession", it might serve as a neat bit of history, not to mention a reminder of what once was, and how grateful we should be that we survived it - and just how bleak that rainy day we're always told to save for, can be.

It's not pessimism, it's immediate, urgent, critical reality, with which we all need to deal. And knowledge is power. Putting your hands over your ears and going "lalalalalala" is not going to help. Now is a time to be informed, if ever there was one, about EVERYTHING that's going on in the industry.

I thought there was already a pretty substantial thread about the current layoffs? I have nothing else to offer other than that thought.

Maybe we could we add room for people to post if they get hired: firm size, location, position, firm's past work.

I am interested in that. This would give us a better idea of firms that are hiring, not just surviving.

I hope no-one tells me to eat a dick on this one, but i know i need the inspiration.

I got hired a month ago along with 3 others.
19th December: Redundant from NBBJ
18th February: Employed at Charcoalblue
Still can't quite believe it.

Was laid off in beginning of October from a large corporate firm in NYC after three years of employment with them; was then hired at a mid-sized firm with better benefits, better people, more responsibility, more interesting work and overall better job conditions in early December. I feel ridiculously lucky.

rejoice, we're in all the journals

link

Massacre today in Roanoke, VA.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/03/27/AR2009032702974.html?hpid=topnews

And now the Washington Post has taken note of our struggles in this economy.

latest dominoes? We've been falling since last summer!

small firm (4 design profs) in northern Mass down 2 ...including ME dammit!!

my structural engineer was laid off yesterday - major engineering firm in seattle - not sure how many were let go this time.

D/FW area has taken several hits since January of this year. I will know more after Monday's mow-down.....

Keep up hope,
-recent architect victim-

I know this is a duplicate thread.

I do not know if the AIA has said anything at all.... but the APA hasn't made a single comment about employment.

This infuriates me. I'm whipping out the 400 bucks in a month to join the ULI.

the AIA can't do much directly to impact employment - it's not a labor union, after all. If the works not there, it's not there.

What the AIA has been doing is advocating for public investment that might stimulate new work for architects. Not sure how that might help firms focused on commercial or residential work - which seems to be the primary arena for job loss.

I know it can't per se but I would like organizations like the APA and the AIA to at least give summary figures on declines of available jobs in the professions they represent.

Not talking about it or ignoring it isn't going to solve very much. The year (late 2007) I graduated the APA has proclaimed that 5,000 planning jobs were going to be created by 2008-- but how many jobs were lost between 2008-2009? I sat around for about 5 months to wait to get an urban designer position that never came to be and the recession denialism at the time didn't let people prepare at all.

Everything can't be sunshine and unicorn farts all the time... professional associations need to be honest in good times and bad times.

AIA has been very active in delivering reports, articles and webinars aimed at helping members of the profession respond to, and survive, the economic downturn. Some of these have been quite good and helpful.

I don't see AIA engaged in "denialism " - they faced up to this thing quite eary and haven't let up yet. But, it has to be said, they have no 'easy button'.

Seriously, can you read? Because I'm pretty sure I was referring to the APA.

As in American Planning Association.

rockandhill: to quote you "I would like organizations like the APA and the AIA to at least give summary figures on declines of available jobs in the professions they represent. ... Not talking about it or ignoring it isn't going to solve very much."

link: AIA Components Helping Out-of-Work Members

Callison in Seattle just laid off bunch of people....

I stand at least correct on the AIA... but the APA is just dogshit.

I got laid yesterday.

Had to get that outta my system + this post seems to be off-track a bit.
Anyway, it even happens to GAWD:
I got laid off 1 week before I was to get on the plane to Dubai in November.

Took off Dec-Jan, then started looking again: I just got a contract today for a new job.

Keep looking, it's out there.

Here

It looks like The third or fourth rounds of layoffs cuts heavily into the heart and soul of a firm's production team.

Last week one of the major firms in my area cut the ENTIRE production staff including all the REVIT and CAD support people. All that's left are the associates, senior associates, and principals. There are two associates who took paycuts and are the only people who are remotely familiar with CAD/BIM. The rest haven't drawn any thing in years. This really got to me because I'm close to many of the people there (or WERE) there. The Principals and SAs were pissed about it too. I spoke with one of the guys who has been in the profession for 40 years and he was just shaking his head claiming how they pulled off this same shit in the early 90s and cost the profession an entire generation of architects...

rockandhill I'm not sure what you want out of these organizations. AIA has a more pressing need to track job losses, given the meltdown in the building/architectural design industry. APA probably less so because the nature of their industry is different. Planners are something less of a commodity (there are fewer of them) and many are not employed by large firms (less of a guild profession, like architecture is), so its harder to track, but anecdotal information suggests relatively few across the board losses. Most layoffs seem to be smallish cut-backs at the agencies. Cyburbia's boards have been doing an outstanding job tracking these, in my opinion. But since they're no crisis as such, I wouldn't expeect that APA would do something special as of yet.

If you had checked the APAs job board a year ago, there was probably a thousand jobs... if you check their board now, there's maybe 100? Out of those hundred, there's probably 3 entry level jobs. I know personally that a lot of major metros and MPOs are dumping planners left and right.

I don't think you can put planners or architects in a commodity or non-commodity category... the work is kind of superfluous in either regard? And the APA isn't just run-of-the-mill urban planners, there's a lot of urban designers, transportation designers et cetera.

The thing I kind of want out of it is a little more proactiveness. Especially the kind of measures they said they'd be supporting at last year's conference-- not a single thing came to be. I'd also like the APA to maybe start dishing out reprimands or some mild negativity. Their publications read like P.R. pieces-- everyone is doing something wonderful with no repercussions and no criticism. It makes it hard to clean out useless planners (who in my mind were partially responsible for the recession) and to cycle in fresh planners with a drive and a bit of a bite?

I don't know. I'm joining the ULI this year because I frankly can't stand the APA. It doesn't do anything except skim thousands of dollars out of people's pockets for AICP certification. I don't care really either way but the whole AICP rules of conduct has what I call an "unlimiting clause" that all other rules or ethics can be invalidated by people's taste and preferences.

"So, you're suppose to do all of this but it isn't necessary if someone wants this? Right."

actually, rockinhill, scratch the last line in my comment there .. I just looked on the APA website. Quite a lot there in terms of coping with the downturn, resources, career advice too.. to be fair, its all behind the member login (yeah, yeah, I admit it, I'm a member of both organizations), but I wouldn't say they've been ignoring the issue altogether. But again, I know of relatively few planners who've lost their jobs.. at least relative to architects like us.

by the way, you said in your post that you are "siiting around" looking for a job in urban design for the last 5 months. Setting aside for a moment the question of whether "sitting around" is the right way to find a job, I must say that I'm a bit confused about your comment on professional organizations. I'm an urban designer. The vast majority of urban designers are architects by training and practice. I'm not sure why you think the APA shold care about urban designers. They do have a Historical Preservation and Urban Design committee but its really about the former, which is within their professional purview, as opposed to the latter, which is inside of ours instead (I am a member of both orgs, to be fair).

Many of my friends in architecture and urban design have been laid off. Very few of my planner friends have been, aside from those who have chosen to not work as planners (for instance, those who choose to work as bankers, real estate developers, and real estate private equity guys.. who are pretty much all unemployed, and I must say for whom I have no sympathy whatsoever).

there's isn't any quantitative data, period. I think what makes this crucial is, unlike the AIA, planning is suppose to have a relatively high level of accountability in theory and in practice. Reheating monster.com career advice is not the most authentic thing in terms of "doing" something proactive.

Hell, I can get that sort of bullshit. The RIBA is actually being fairly transparent and quantitative in reporting and understanding the economy job situation.

For you other comment, Urban Design isn't necessarily a subset of architecture nor is it a subset of planning. I think it exists in between-- however, to be an urban designer in the public realm or for a large developer tends to fall under the guise of planning than architecture. Maybe private practice is different? But even then, I've seen more urban design (whether schools of architecture or not) being more lumped into planning than architecture as far as academia is concerned.

I personally do not think architecture and urban design should overlap as architecture tends to not be affordable or utilitarian in nature (you can argue this all you want). The arrangement of streets, public furniture, amenities and so forth should not be in the hands of "art."

Me and about 2 million people my age (who are not on the department of labor's radar as we are "non-working or considered no longer seeking employment") have been reduced to "sitting around" looking for jobs. We got sold on this whole college deal, the boom mentality, loans et cetera... that our credit and available finances are spread so thin is becoming painful to even pay for printing and postage stamps.

Can I afford to spend 300 dollars a week to drive around the southeast begging for a job in real life? Can I afford to sit around very much longer and pump out resumes over websites and emails all day long? Can I afford to buy a headhunter? Do I have anymore plastic left to swipe, relatives to borrow from, lines of credit et cetera (thank god there's no mafia in florida)?

So, yeah, sitting around and literally bumming it is a lot of what people my age have left for options. I have participated in competitions (with little to no reply back but they sure did cash those money orders quickly), I have done pro-bono work, the places I volunteered no longer have money or work for volunteers anymore... so yeah, it's tough.

The other problem here is that for real entry-level jobs, you have to go to your huge organizations. As far as planning goes now, you have to do the reverse of 'good career advice [that is working in some shit hole town in the middle of nowhere for two years].' Why? Because so many assholes have screwed these places over doing this and typically small towns that can afford planners are extremely affluent places who want the most bang (masters with two years) for their buck (35k).

So, for entry level folks like myself, all of the big public and private places have started to dry up.

I would gladly pay the APA, ULI or the AIA if they had their own headhunters or career counselors who could 'endorse' good resumes and pass them along.

I would appreciate if they actually made any of their current programs work. I would appreciate it if they policed their own jobs boards. I would appreciate it if the APA actually did one thing it promised to do.

The president of the APA, starting from last years conference to about 6 months ago, did nothing but rail about entry-level job creation, getting young people into the profession and turning over jobs.

Has any of that been done? Probably not but I wouldn't know either way because the APA doesn't even audit their own initiatives and programs by collecting valid data and publishing it. Why would you pay for an organization that doesn't produce any results and doesn't produce any data to verify success of failure?

Just found out that one of my buds was laid off in Seattle. Since he was an aquaintence rather than a good friend, now I don't know where to find him. *SIGH*

Rock - my wife is in the same boat - unemployed, but not able to get unemployment due to school. she's a "housewife" therefore it's my responsibility to pay her way. At least I haven't lost my job yet.

rockandhill: I totally agree with you on the headhunter thing. I have many friends in the business and finance sector and they've all asked me if I've contacted a headhunter. They even sent me the business headhunters that got them their jobs hoping they could help me. I really don't think these headhunters exist other than one I know that was merely looking to fill empty production seats a year ago.

Yeah, I would gladly pay a headhunter who knew something about planning, architecture or design to represent me if they knew what "good work" was.

Hell, I'd even sign a contract that says I have to pay so-and-so to endorse me and get me a job. But most HR people don't know architecture, planning and so on... so it might be a lucrative business idea for someone who has experience in the field to attempt.

I'll even suck a dick.

rockandhill,, most architects and planners dont know what "good work" is,, means you are almost asking for a statistical impossibility

I contacted a headhunter out of Philly back in late 2001. This guy knew his shit about all the firms from DC to NY and west out to Pittsburgh. I had gotten some interviews on my own at the time and he filled me in about what the management style was, etc. etc. After going to those interviews it was clear the guy knew what he was talking about. At the time the places he wanted to get me into weren't hiring (9/11 fallout) and thus it didn't work out. Would be interesting to contact him again and see what the verdict is today.

So, there are headhunters out there that really do know the architecture/design field. Problem is nobody is hiring. No matter how good a headhunter is, if nobody is hiring they can't do much for you.

In an architecture firm, it feels urban designers are definitely doing better than architects if you are a good one. My old boss whose's been making master plans in a corporate firm even got a promotion while others were getting cut off.
In contrast, I'm a planner turned urban designer wannabe but apparently not doing a great job so I have got laid off TWICE already since last October. First time from a corporate firm in Octorber and then started with a boutique firm in February this year but again officially bumped off this Monday...
My old boss said that it is always gonna be like that and I'd better just go back to school for a law degree. He thinks it is so cool that lawyers makes a lot of money thought he himself is now high in the corporate firm now.

One firm I know in NYC just laid off 20 out of its 35 employees. Not sure why they didn't just shut the place down. Since there's no work left, it will probably go down to 2-3 people pretty soon.

to make those who remain feel more leet and work them harder i suspect

some places will 'lay you off' but when they report it they will say you 'got fired' so they don't have to pay unemployment tax (or what ever they have to pay). plus if they say you were fired, then you will not be able to get unemployment.

just found this out today

"some places will 'lay you off' but when they report it they will say you 'got fired'

this is easy enough to challenge through the department of labor in your state. if a situation like this is challenged, the DOL will investigate and the facts will come out.

in our state, we are required to provide every departing employee a form, stating the reason for that person's departure. if you get one that states a false reason, you can challenge it on the spot. they may not change it, but at least you know what you'll be dealing with.

most DOLs are pretty smart about dealing with situations like this - I don't think many people are denied unemployment unless it's a clear case of the employee being a true f**k-up.

wow ....thats pretty drastic annon ....and i thought things were starting to look better

anyone feel that the scene is getting better lately? outthere, how is the nyc these days?

uh....here we go from NYC...mid-size firm..used to be really successful....wide variety of work...., we laid off 10 people in march...and antoher 25 today. pay cuts all around, and who knows if its over. i would definitely not say that the scene is getting better! now, we are going to more interviews for prospective projects now than a few months ago, but with the lag before anythign would start...i'd say we still have months of this to look forward to....

anyone having a different experience? my friends in DC say their firms are hiring! its the only city in the US not feeling this recession.

names please!

Atsama, a vast majority of DC firms have had layoffs.

However, these days the whispers around the city is that things have been picking up and most of my friends who have survived are completely overworked with pay cuts.

Back in the fall/winter-not long after I was first laid off-I was encouraged by some friends living in the DC/Baltimore area to check out some firms that were 'hiring' I applied to probably 25+ places and interviewed at several, but almost every firm I talked to said they werent actually actively hiring but were accepting applications/doing interview so when they did need someone in the next few months they wouldnt have to go through the hiring process. Though, as far as I know, none of these places have hired anyone. I have been done the generic 'information interview' that wasnt for a specific job in Chicago too, but most firms here arent really advertising jobs that dont exsist the way some places in DC were.

layoffs at Perkins+Will firmwide today....

RTKL had some more layoffs last week.