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Running own practice or work for people?

fuzzy_atelier

i should sound more confident if i want to run my own practice, but i'm not... well, here's my dilemma - i passed my registration exam a few months ago after started a new job in a new place.

here i am. a few months down the track, i'm not exactly very happy. i keep telling myself to hang in there... for just a bit while... to gain some expertise experience in my current job... in this sizeable project... (maybe will look good on resume... although i've done similar type of project before)... i'm still adjusting to a new place, new office, new people, in a rather messy system (they are still setting up the system for the project)... i expected something better than this when i took up the job.

here's my question: should i hang in here for another 6 months to a year? or should i just quit and start my own practice - immediately? that, being my dream. should i NOT waste anymore time tweaking with plans in a big team, and start learning the skill of running a practice by getting into it - soon? it's a different ball game altogether i know.






 
Feb 19, 08 5:08 am
file

the only real question is this: are you ready to be self employed?

i.e. do you have the economic wherewithal to survive without much income for a while? do you have the emotional maturity to stand entirely on your own and succeed? do you have, or know how to get, decent clients? can you deliver projects entirely on your own? are you experienced
in hiring and managing staff, when that time comes? are you prepared to make and manage the myriad financial and accounting decisions you must make? when you work for yourself, this list becomes endless!

it's great to take the leap - just be sure you're ready.

Feb 19, 08 7:08 am  · 
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liberty bell

My personal advice: Don't take the leap until you have at least one, preferably more, freelance jobs done. It's baptism by fire out there, and it's best to simultaneously learn about running your own show while continuing to be paid by (and learn from) an employer.

Then once you've completed a few freelance jobs while being employed, don't quit your day job until you have one big or two small freelance jobs under contract PLUS three or four more in the wings.

It's all networking and word of mouth, you don't just hang a sign in your window and wait for people to come find you. Concentrate now on building that network while you have a paycheck.

Feb 19, 08 7:20 am  · 
 · 
citizen

"Running own practice or work for people?"

This choice seems plain, but is quite different when you're starting out versus having worked for years, as File and LB suggest.

One of the main things to consider when being a sole practitioner, per LB, is that not only do you have to DO the work, you have to go out and GET the work. While you're doing the CDs for this job, you have to also be out there tracking down 4, 5, or 10 leads for just the next single project.

Feb 19, 08 11:24 am  · 
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treekiller

why not find a new job?

Feb 19, 08 12:08 pm  · 
 · 

i agree with TK... why not just find a new job...

the ability to go out on your own is so dependent on a variety of things that it is hard to answer in generalizations...

how long have you been in the field? what type of experience do you have? have you taken a lot of projects from start to finish? do you have any experience in the business side of things (i.e. writing proposals and dealing with clients/contractors/consultants)? do you have a lot of contacts in the community that can become and/or bring you clients?

back in november i left my old job to "go out on my own"... but i've been sorta easing into it... i have been working as an independent contractor for two different firms that i have previous ties to... one of them is on a single project and the other is working part time in their studio... both would like for me to come on with them full time... in addition to the IC work, i have one decent sized residence and a few other small projects lined up to do on my own...

however, one caveat in my circumstance is that i'm planning on going back to school in the fall... so i'm really only doing this in the short term... or at least that's the idea... if i don't get into any schools then i'll have to make the decision between staying the course with the IC work and misc. projects, joining a firm full time, or going the rest of the way toward starting my own firm... i'm not sure what the future holds... but it's working for me right now...

Feb 19, 08 12:46 pm  · 
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whistler

Every time I see these type of threads it bothers me that people think they just open their door and clients walk in. Opening or starting an office and getting plenty of work to keep you busy is mad. Its one of the more stressful times in your life, you need at least a steady income assuming you have rent, and other payments. Its starting everything from scratch, business cards, accounting, promotion, and of course getting work done, ( by the way the first three items don't bring in money they cost you money ). If your new nobody typically wants to hire a newbie, so you do the work for cheap and that doesn't really help.

My advice is to get a steady paycheck coming in, it only has to be a 20 hr/ week job that covers your basic expenses( ie a simple contract job/ part-time situation in Arch or not, then put all your other time into developing your business. Generating cash flow, clients, and doing good work takes lots of effort and it needs to be done everyday not just when your finished the first job, for every 10 leads you might get 1 job and more than likely its not the best job but you have to start somewhere and look at every job as a step to the next one. Every job can be promotion for the next through connections, visibility, specialization of building type, etc. Get to know some good builders too I work in a town where half my clients come from the builders recommending me, or realtors ( although not nearly as good as builders for dependability )

Feb 19, 08 1:09 pm  · 
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Sean Taylor

I agree with LB and Whistler. You should think of opening your own practice more as a transition from working for someone. Basically, build out your freelance practice while working for someone else until it grows to the point that it is physically impossible to keep your "day job" and run your freelance practice simultaneously. That should be your clue to evaluate if you have enough work to make it on your own. Basically, get scrappy and take small jobs and then leverage that experience into getting larger jobs, etc. etc.

As Whistler expressed, it does not matter how much talent you think you have. Architecture is an expensive and risky investment and most clients would rather not risk their investment on someone just starting out.

Feb 19, 08 1:34 pm  · 
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one question: do you have the finances to set out on your own

Feb 19, 08 1:54 pm  · 
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trace™

Patience and perseverance are the key words. Can you cry, curse, starve and swear, and emerge quickly with steadfast optimism? If you have that resiliency, then you can do it. But, as everyone is pointing out, don't expect 'freedom' or 'perfection'.

It's a great feeling to run your own show and make more money, but don't let anyone convince you it is as easy as working for someone else. If it were, then everyone would be doing.

Save up as much as possible, and if you can, keep working somewhere until you are overwhelmed with personal projects. Once you no longer have time to sleep, have enough money coming in on the side to survive, then it won't be a question anymore.


Oh, one last thing (again, as everyone is pointing out) - talent equals squat. Someday it'll bring back business, but in the beginning it means very, very little. All you have to do is look around, plenty of hacks that have successful businesses, plenty of talent that is starving.


Good luck

Feb 19, 08 2:07 pm  · 
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sponge

Let me preface this response, with an, "I don't have a practice, but I'd like to start one in the next few years", comment.

I agree that the most important consideration is finances and whether or not you have clients lined up. Do you have a substantial savings, or a spouse that can carry the load for a bit, or wealthy family to help you out? If not, you can't just up and quit your job. I would start the basics of your business now while working for someone else: create a logo, your business cards, your website, figure out the process for getting a business license......then start hunting for freelance work. Focus on saving money until you have a comfortable cushion. If you want it badly enough consider getting a roommate (if you don't have one/ are living alone) to cut your costs.

Now if you're working for a firm where you constantly have to put in 60+ hrs a week, doing a hoard of freelance jobs at the same time as working for them probably won't work. Once you have a good freelance gig + savings you can consider going part time.

I would also encourage you to self evaluate your strengths and weaknesses within architecture at this point--contracts, marketing, detailing, code--whatever it may be, and make a concerted effort to learn more in those arenas while you work for someone else/save money. It doesn't have to be 5 yrs of working for someones else, it could be one year, if you are proactive about asking for the right assignments at work. If you can't get the experience you need to go solo at your current job consider switching. Working as a cad monkey doesn't help anyone learn they skills they need to go solo.

Now, maybe you have an ultra hot client with a remarkable project lined up and in contract. Personally, I'd go part time at my job, know my weaknesses, and hire a consultant to back me up with any problem areas I might have. If you do this, make sure you follow what they're doing, so you can do it yourself next time .

Feb 19, 08 4:12 pm  · 
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kyll

everyone pretty much covered it above, so i'm going to give you my take:

I -

-worked in 3 firms in 6 years - lotsa projects. good experience level
-then started own design studio (non-licensed, thus "designer") while working at last firm
-went fully on my own as a consultant, doing cad dwgs for a high-end boutique design company as one of my clients
- landed two clients - small design jobs in two months
-finished two small design jobs for clients in three weeks
- finished consultancy with boutique company two weeks later
- promoted business continuously
- went cashless for a month
- went back to a firm

point is: that sh*t isnt easy

i'll try again later on..

Feb 20, 08 10:41 am  · 
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whistler

I found that I needed to have six months work in front of me before I felt comfortable with a reasonable workload, once I had multiple jobs with six months work I hired somebody. Now with several staff I need about a year's worth of work in front of me before I feel the same comfort level. So with about 5-6 staff we have about 20 active projects in different stages, some projects are also long term rezoning or planning projects which we like, as they typically span multiple years.

Feb 20, 08 1:40 pm  · 
 · 

i had plenty of work, good location,etc but...


i hated being on my own.

my biggest problems, the things i despised: generating billing, getting billed.

Feb 20, 08 9:37 pm  · 
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i agree with steven. i have a partner. alone would be not fun at all.

Feb 21, 08 9:59 am  · 
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quizzical

fuzzy ... you're getting good advice above ... I hope you give it some serious attention.

having your own firm can be a lot of fun and very rewarding ... but, it's a very different experience from working for somebody else.

you're entirely on your own, especially if you're practicing as a sole proprietor. you have to undertake a lot of tasks that you may not know how to do initially and really may not enjoy. you won't survive if you don't figure out how to get that work accomplished.

that's why so many firms that survive start with at least two, but more often, three founding principals. usually, in a group that size, the full range of skills and experience needed for survival can be found and applied to the tasks at hand. it's not uncommon for one partner to bring the design expertise, another to bring the technical expertise and the third to bring the business acumen.

best wishes, and good luck.

Feb 21, 08 3:35 pm  · 
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JsBach

Speaking from experience, I wouldn't even think about starting my own office unless I had firm commitments for enough work to keep me going for a long time. Hopefully from multiple clients. Even then expect to spend half your time marketing and doing business related work, not as much time on the board doing architecture.

Feb 21, 08 11:37 pm  · 
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fuzzy_atelier

thank you all for your very valuable advice... you have helped me to think more SERIOUSLY what entail in opening up and running a practice. i chuckled when i read the advice that it's not just hang a sign in the window and wait for people to come... please don't laugh when i tell you i have that thought in my mind quite often and always get a sense of sweet thrill everytime i think of that.

i have worked constantly for almost 9 years (3 very different firms; now my 4th) and never felt ready for registration until recently. many of you suggested that getting freelance commissions is a start. the only thing is, i don't have much time to do freelance work as i put in a lot of hours in my day job and i'm just so poofed out after that... unless you have any advice of how to break that cycle? that explains why i'm so tempted to just quit my job and do my own stuff, start from scratch, aka hang a sign in my window... (it's abrupt i know)

one of your advice is working part-time/contract... i've seriously thought about that as it would really give me some time and energy to plan and build up my practice slowly while still having some fixed income.









Feb 22, 08 5:53 am  · 
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brian buchalski

yes, i think that you should just quit your job and start from scratch then you can tell us all about it right here on archinect. that would be interesting to watch.

Feb 22, 08 8:17 am  · 
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Data

Here is my specific experience, my partners and I talked about going out on our own maybe 5-7 years ago. One us took the leap 4 years ago, starved scraped his way with very little clientele and small projects, 2 us stayed in fulltime positions. In 2006 we actually had a good prospect a developer came to town talking about this project (maybe 10 mil) they wanted us to work on for them, we started in full force, hired a civil to do the survey. I thought about leaving but wanted to wait until the money started coming in. After two months and multiple invoices no payment and we are stuck with a 10k consultant bill. Lawyer says write it off because it will cost more to go through litigation. Luckily only one partner came on full time, the other partner and I were still maintaining full time jobs. Beginning of 2007 we start negotiating with an institutional client for another large project. Selection is supposed to happen in April. RFP gets reissued because of funding. In May they start negotiating with our team exclusively, June we find out we are selected. Contract gets signed in mid August, I quit my job to come on full time (other partner with business background stays working.) We borrow start up capital from family. End of November we are stressing first invoice has not cleared and we are at the end of borrowed money. December 1 first decent check comes in. We start paying selves and taking on debt we have accumulated. Hire first employee beginning of January. Still sweating the lag in invoices from client. Should be in the black hopefully by June, and should bring on the last Partner by September.

It took us 4-5 years to really get it together, got stiffed a couple times along the way. Once a good client came on we were able to ramp up in 6-12 months. I would say wait until you have a stable client that you know is going to pay the bills. Savings can be misleading unless you have over 100k you can eat through it very fast trying to start up a practice.

Also note I maintain a part time teaching gig, but because of my financial sititution (mortgage, wife, two kids) it was not sufficient to support us. I also spoke with a previous employer about freelancing and they were open to it, but I declined because I still wanted the client before branching out.

Feb 22, 08 11:51 am  · 
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file
Data

: if I had a nickel for every time I've heard that identical sort of story from folks who started a firm, I would not have to practice architecture for a living. It's damn tough.

Glad to hear you're making a go of it.

Feb 22, 08 11:55 am  · 
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evilplatypus

people totally underestimate how rampant nonpayment is in this proffesion. I'll never understand why. Its as if we are looked at as part of the risk taking team although we share the loss if the deal falls through but not if it makes money. You really have to pick your clients wisely. Even then its tuff. One of our clients is a bank whos always 6-8 months behind on their payments. And theyre a friggn bank!

Feb 22, 08 12:24 pm  · 
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whistler

Total contrast but I did once have a client actually knock on the door once and ended up being one of our best clients. I was working out of my garage with one staffer and he was told to come see me because of a previous project we had done, so he and his wife went for a walk and knocked on the door, totally scared the shit out of us ... why would anybody knock on the door, very funny in hind sight.

Data's comments are so very true always good to have multiple income sources even if they are great clients if a payment's late and it happens, your covered and can make payroll. Just a hint but commercial / corporate clients have accountants and write checks in a regular 15/30 period and therefore if your timely and professional with billing you'll get paid regularly. Single Family Residential clients typically write checks on a whim and you will typically have to chase them down, al thought I haven't really had too many problems over the last 10 years. Every once and a while though it happens.

Most important know your client if you get a bad vibe don't take the job. Chasing money and not getting paid is a total time suck and if your chasing money your not making any, don't fall in love with the job before a contract is signed or you have a retainer. I always make sure I can bill a small amount in the first month ie $500.00 to see how fast the first cheque takes that way you haven't committed too much time and you'll know how serious the client is.
(I learned that the hard way)

Feb 22, 08 12:38 pm  · 
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dsc_arch

There have been a lot of great posts. Two thoughts

1. Freelance work while working for another firm.
A. If your employer is cool w/ it no problem
B. If not then you are already competing w/ him or her. Not just for fees but your attention.

2. Don't forget it is not all or nothing.
If it works out great. If not you become the best employee around.

I say go for it. Hang out your shingle. See who comes knocking.

Feb 22, 08 10:43 pm  · 
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farwest1

Re: Data's post,
Don't do free work for developers! Many, if not most, of the developers I've worked for suck you in with the promise of a sexy big project. You see visions of award winning skyscrapers. You do tons of design work, only to have them bail when a) the financing doesn't come through, b) the project isn't as salable as they thought, c) they find a cooler, cheaper architect to work with, or d) they get bored. They leave you with the bill.

You can woo developers with your previous work, or do a little bit on the side. But don't bank on a developer paying -- they expect stupid architects to work for free. And so many of us do.

Re: starting your own firm,
How have your spouses dealt with going out on your own? This is a big issue for me. I might be able to deal with the risk and the low income starting out, but it would stress my wife out far more than me.

Feb 26, 08 5:09 pm  · 
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quizzical

partners at work / partners in life - an important dynamic.

partners in life are a very delicate factor in deciding to go out on your own. while not "officially" a part of the business, they're always just offstage, waiting in the wings. they have enormous influence on the life of a firm, albeit indirectly.

it's good to factor that in.

Feb 26, 08 9:04 pm  · 
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liberty bell

If your spouse has a decent job and you can get health insurance through them, that's a huge benefit. Health insurance is killing me, as my husband is a freelance teacher (g*ddamn universities only hire adjunct faculty these days) and sculptor.

Feb 26, 08 10:08 pm  · 
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Data

the developer experience taught us a couple valuable lesson, probably most important include a clause in your subcontract for "paid when paid." Also, specifically with developers move slow to see if they have the capital to fund the work, or get a sizable retainer up front. Lastly, from an architecture business standpoint you do not want to rely on developer clients (my last firm carried a 2.2m line of credit to accomodate non payments from developers.) The work we go after now is institutional work, either city, state, county or federal projects, along with stable owner occupiers, small museum/galleries, clinics/hospitals. For development we are attempting to develop a couple small infill projects ourselves but are very leery about working with or for developers.

My spouse was anxious about 2 items when we started out. first was money, and second was healthcare. before I made the leap we made sure we had a enough work under contract (currently 2 years) that would permit us to make more money than we were previously. regarding healthcare we set up a group plan with blue cross, large deductible plan and have the company fund 1k annually of an HSA account.

Feb 27, 08 8:49 am  · 
 · 

I have been pencilling out how to make the transition to private practice now well, uhmm - okay since entering architectural school. It has been a while since I've left, and I must admit that the closer I get to arming myself with the necessary skills/tools to make the transition the less practical I see it. Case in point, I started out like most cad monkey'ing, but wanted to design - so did everyone else. So I picked PM, get ratified etc - did a few consulting jobs on the side to test the potential (larger clients, usually in a bind). The intention however was to have all the skills necessary to start a practice on my own. But what happens is that I have not found a way to get the projects I want without staff; and I can't have staff without the projects that pay enough to warrant that. So I have recognised that you will have to get to a point when the numbers are small enough to swallow, and take that leap of faith. I wish you all the luck!

Feb 27, 08 2:56 pm  · 
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whistler

Bottom line you are never ready to start your own office.... the opportunity presents itself and you jump in! Its like kids or getting married you just can't get 100% organized for the event but somehow you manage. Its a test and hopefully you have the skill set and are adept and nimble enough to make it through the tough transitional period. The start up is a transitional time and figuring it out is a trial by fire.

All I can say is make sure you do good work, have cash flow ( just so that the whole self employment thing seems like a worthwhile idea), have work flow ( more important and don't be discouraged by not getting ever project. Work your network as best you can.

Feb 27, 08 3:08 pm  · 
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farwest1

Another twist on this question is that I've had a couple of close friends ask me about doing projects for them. But I've been reluctant to do work for close friends. I've seen it ruin friendships when the projects go bad.

I do, however, feel like I'm passing up some potentially good work--as well as clients who understand me, and me them. Any advice about taking work from close friends?

Feb 27, 08 9:15 pm  · 
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blackcomb1

I've done a few single family homes for friends cut them a deal on fees ( not cheap just kept the whole package tight and uncomplicated ) It is a bit tense if things goes sideways but everyone's a big boy about the whole thing so it worked out. I would say in my case there was a mutual level of respect and I didn't push them somewhere they didn't want to go. I looked at it as though the project would happen with me or without me but if I didn't do it the fear is that the project wouldn't turn out well and I looked at it as though I would be happier if I could assist rather than watching a train wreck. If you can avoid it, all the better but I felt it was a better i helped than not. I think my friends ( still ) would agree.

Feb 28, 08 12:50 am  · 
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quizzical

hopefullly - over time - many clients will become friends. friends trust each other, and trust is the basis of a good client/consultant relationship. you've got to learn to work for friends.

i've never had a problem doing work for people who were friends first. but, you can't let the friendship overwhelm your business sense. you still need to go through the normal process - proposal, scope of work, budget, schedule, fees, contract, invoices - don't short circuit any of that. if the friend objects, say you need to do it "to protect and preserve the friendship"

most client relationships go astray over insufficient attention to such matters - don't lose your friend because you short-circuited your professionalism.

Feb 28, 08 7:15 am  · 
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evilplatypus

imagine if you were trying to start your own practice and when design oppurtunities arise in your network your father, a design build contractor, sells them on going with him instead of an architect. What Joy that is.

Feb 28, 08 10:03 am  · 
 · 

damn evil did that happen to you? Did you a Mendez brothers? No one would wrong you if you did

Feb 28, 08 10:50 am  · 
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evilplatypus

No thats insane! The problem is he's very good, honest and better than most architects. But in the spirit of competition, alls fair. Im just saying - try starting something rolling while standing next to a design build machine, you learn to kill and eat very quickly.

Feb 28, 08 11:28 am  · 
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farwest1

Any chance of teaming up with him, becoming sort of the design arm of his business? Seems like that's an insta-network for you.....

Feb 28, 08 11:38 am  · 
 · 

I second farwest - THAT seems to be the more practical solution, granted its like returning home after living on your own eh?

Feb 28, 08 12:16 pm  · 
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evilplatypus

We have worked together, Ive actually been a carpenter and contractor there as well as done design work - its a construction business, not an architecture business. ive also worked in a few big offices in Chicago. Theres no chance of practicing architecture in a construction company. Its actually illeagal in Ill unless 2/3 board of directors are registered. But as design builder - they do about 30% DB - their own design work and thats where it gets interesting - theyve been residential remodelr of the year for their price group 2x and well quite frankly they beat architect's asses at design skill in that market. We used architecture simply as a marketing tool, actualy it was free - part of the sales. Our drawings were sketches (which were way more accurate than most architects ive seen) and we had an old guy stamp them, some input. But amazingly what we got done 9 out of 10 residential architects cant even come close to.

This is why I tell people all the time who think design build is some sort of magic solution - design build is designing for the builder's budgeted allowances and tastes usually.

Anyways thats just my boat. Thats why I hate these people complaining about how bad architecture is - if they knew how hard it is to be a successful builder, doing classy work in MULTIPLE markets, not just one building type, they'd never complain about contractors again and actually might realize one day they will be running all projects under a certain $ dollar.

Feb 28, 08 1:46 pm  · 
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blah

I think the most difficult part about architecture is transcending the idea into a reality that costs money, requires a timeframe and someone to build it. I have worked at places where money was no object and now the reality is different. I tried to make a simple detail with a door with floor-to-ceiling, channel glass sidelights and a desire for a single mullion. It took 20 phone calls to the manufacturer, rep and glass fabricator that added up to about 80 hours of time. At one point it got really ridiculous. I explained to the president of the company how his product could do what I wanted. He was a little embarrassed that he didn't know that it could be done but very accommodating once I specified his the parts and explained it to him. I didn't get paid for the extra effort and I am not too happy about it. But if you want to try to do Architecture, like what Ron Krueck does here in Chicago, it requires a tremendous effort. The client was appreciative and likes the work but was ready to abandon it. The whole project depends on this detail and others like it. The difficulty is that Dwell Magazine makes people think that design is easy and it should be free. The budget and scope is not big enough to get anyone else to do the heavy lifting so I have ended up there.

The morale to my story is that if you want to do the stuff you see in the German magazine DETAIL, you need a fee of at least 15%, a patient contractor and a willing client. You also need very strong visuals. Beautiful renderings can help.

But it's really difficult to do good work and it's not for everyone.

Feb 28, 08 3:25 pm  · 
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evilplatypus

Thats actualy what design builders ( the good ones - the ones who invented the method in the 80's) actually do. They free up the architect to design, and they execute or find a way to with in budget. But the passion is there on both sides - well most of the time.

I'd love to see a picture of that door make -

Feb 28, 08 3:35 pm  · 
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whistler

So true make.... I spent a tremendous amount of time just getting a siding stained in the factory the way my sample had turned out. took about three weeks and several test boards to get it right. It was my house so if it didn't work I would have to live with it which I wasn't particularly interested in. The end result was perfect and totally worth the time and effort, any thing less would have been a disater.

Feb 28, 08 5:06 pm  · 
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farwest1

This issue is twofold, in my experience. Contractors don't want to build anything they haven't built many times before, and not for any insidious or lazy reason. They just don't want the risk that a new design will leak/fail and leave them with a lawsuit.

And product manufacturers don't take on new or unusual products for the same reason.

It's not that contractors or product reps don't WANT to do new, amazing work. It's that a litigious system in the U.S. works against them (and therefore us as architects.) They just don't want to get sued.

Feb 28, 08 5:50 pm  · 
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evilplatypus

exactly farwest - but to take it a step further - it is more often them who gets sued so therefore when they do want to do an exciting "concept" ( note i didnt say design) the design builder will insist on designing the details, so the responsibility is on them. The flipside is that the arch of record will always be responsible to a point in the design build relationship that is contractor led.

I used to actually draw details at my dad's shop and pdf them to architects in the city. When we would get the drawings for construction they would scan my details into their sets like whoa - we didnt do this. So its strange - they wanted a pocketed, railess sliding glass entry door, but wouldnt detail it, so we did. Its a whole lot more complex in reality. In fact its a pisser.

Feb 28, 08 6:07 pm  · 
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